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/site/ - Suggestion, etiquette for "Artsy Fartsy" boards.
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691 No. 691 watch
I think there should be some rule of etiquette for the fanwork boards, /art/ and /fic/.

As an artist, it saddens me to see how the pony community is when it comes to fanworks. Whenever I visit Ponychan's /fic/ in the past, there's always someone who wants to "review fics", want to "criticize", or slam a person just because "they can't write".

What these people don't realize is that fans put a lot of hard work into their things, whether it's a simple sketch, or a fanfic. Fans are NOT professionals, they do this because they like the show and ponies.

There is a big difference between someone asking for proofreading and improvements, and someone who just want to share a story they came up with. People can have opinions, but there is a difference telling someone that "it wasn't their cup of tea" and "You need to be slapped by a well written book and learn how to write!"

I can't help but think the elitist prereaders of Equestria Daily helped influence this on fans. Fan-fiction and fan-art has never been a professional form of medium, never has, and never will be. Just because there's quality works, does not mean slam or attack others for simply being fans and creative.

Thanks for your time reading this guys. I just hate for this to become the next Equestria Daily or Ponychan /fic/.
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No. 705
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705
As a person who makes videos for the brony community, and for the benefit of myself and the career path I choose to take, I support this.

Though, I understand how EqD, and some others has their own boundaries, but sometimes they compromise. I've seen the worst (IMO) PMVs and fanfics (eg. Cupcakes) and the most simple artwork. The compromise of videos would be their content, but not always limited to one aspect (lack of editing, but good concept). Fanfics, on the other hand, they look for grammar skill, to what level I do not know. Cupcakes was a mistake on their part. Many spelling mistakes (if recalled correctly) and the most basic concept of torture. From vectors to paintbrushes, artists have different styles (unless you go Egoraptor) and in my view, none of them should be bashed. So what if they're bad at it, at least give them some nice criticism.

To conclude, I do support this.
No. 706
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706
>implying our boards will ever get enough traffic for that to happen

I support this, though.
No. 711
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711
I'm in support of this. As someone who likes to dabble in creativity, there's nothing worse than being shut down because you didn't write to someone's liking and they are attacking you for it. I'm for this; in fact, I think civility in (most) places should be expected. Direct attacks on others should be shunned. Not suggesting a draconian rule, but basically my opinion can be summed up by this

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0la5DBtOVNI

>>TL;DR I SUPPORT THIS<<
No. 712
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712
I agree. I will work on this when I merge the boards. Thank you for your input
No. 715
>>712
DO NOT EVER POST THAT PIC AGAIN
No. 716
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716
>>715
Which one? This one?
No. 717
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717
>>716
FFFFFFFUUUUUUUUUUUUUUU--
No. 718
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718
Thanks for the support everypony! ^__^

>>715
Why not?
>pic
No. 719
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719
>>715
Is this one better?
No. 727
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727
Just to add, this is NOT to stop constructive criticism or advice to those who want it. This is for those who want to share something for the sake of sharing it, and not looking for advice on improving it.

After all, it's rude to share something you made with someone and they pick it apart looking for this and that wrong, when you didn't ask for it in the first place. If someone asks how they can improve then go ahead and help them out. Don't go ripping everything apart if a fan wants to show you something they made just for the sake of having it meet a certain criteria.

In fact, when I posted a Fluttershy sketch to my DA page, I had to request that no one gives me constructive criticism. Why? Because it was something I did for fun because I like Fluttershy, and just wanted to share it with friends I know who likes ponies.

If someone wants to know what to improve, they'll ask for it. If they don't, don't be rude and tell them what to do and what not to do.

That's my two cents on that issue, since there are people who want to improve their works too.
No. 733
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733
Well i agree with this wholeheartedly. I dont want to see people getting there work bashed and have that make them want to stop.
No. 734
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734
Well i agree with this wholeheartedly. I dont want to see people getting there work bashed and have that make them want to stop.
No. 735
>>733
>>734

>post this post
>get banned for a second
>post goes through twice

wtf
No. 737
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737
I have heard about concern EQD before. But I consider it just their policy, since it's really "display window" for fan's work in general. I remember writing one fanfic adventure-story about Gilda and dǝrpy and sent it to /fic/ but it got just "grammar was bad, so I didn't bother to read it more than just one page".

> I just hate for this to become the next Equestria Daily or Ponychan /fic/.

Can you explain this a little?
No. 738
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738
>>737
Sure, I visited /fic/ a few times in the past, on Ponychan. Basically most I've seen are concerned with providing constructive criticism. While it's not a bad thing, it's rude to rip apart something looking for this wrong and that wrong, especially if the writer never asked for it to begin with.

If the writer wants to improve, then they'll ask or post in a critique thread. Some people just want to share what they made.

Well, from what I get with Equestria Daily, they take pony stuff way too seriously. Pre-readers and the audience (I've read quite a bit about their fanbase). It's a hobby, something one enjoys for fun. Also Equestria Daily usually treats you badly if they reject something or find something they don't like. At least they did that to me. I don't want to see a fellow Lunachanner post something to share, only to get the Equestria Daily treatment, when they just want to share something with others.

All I'm saying is this, if someone shares something, then take it as is, and enjoy it based on your preference. If someone wants to improve their work, then they will request it.
No. 742
What I'm about to say is from the perspective of a visitor from Ponychan's /fic/.

>>738
>Equestria Daily usually treats you badly if they reject something or find something they don't like
The audience might be a vocal bunch of tossers at times, but if the pre-readers are being rude, then there's a problem, because that shouldn't be happening. If you got the blunt end of the stick there, it's a rare event and the pre-reader was probably having a bad day and you should have emailed the pre-reader back and demanded an apology.

...On the flip side, I see you use words like
>wants to "review fics", want to "criticize"
>slam
>elitist
>hate
>rip apart
And that seems pretty... well, accusatory. I get that you want this to stay a place where you can share your fics without getting attacked, but... Well, I'm not sure where I'm going with this, but I'm posting it anyways. I'll probably have something more to say later.
No. 743
>>742
Two words really, first impression. For both Equestria Daily and /fic/

Equestria Daily, I submit the first time, told rudely "Mmnope" and to expand it because a short story is "a summary". Submit again, and they treat me like I can't properly write, and ban my first fic while their at it. An attitude like that does not guarantee more submissions, loses a visitor, and leads to person telling others their experience. Not just me, others too. One person over at Pony Fiction Archive was flat out told to "go away".

As for those words, again first impressions. I went to /fic/ a few times last summer, and everytime I visit, people just look for things to tell others to improve on. What if the person just wanted to share something they made, and not want to improve or get feedback. It's very rude to analyze someone's fan fic and artwork, when they just wanted to share. If someone wants to improve or wanted feedback, they will ask or post in a "review thread" (like the thread you prepared in our /fic/).

As for elitist and slam, I blame that first impression on that guy I saw on /fic/ the other day. I'm sure not everyone is like that, but remember first impressions.

To compare, it's like a going to a store for the first time (lack of comparison) and getting horrible customer service. Because it was so horrible, you don't want to return, and let everyone you know not to go.
No. 745
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745
>>743
I do hope you won't let first impressions be your basis of judgment for everything on the matter. Off topic: You do realize that these "first impressions" are probably the same reasons that Equestria Daily pre-readers reject fics after looking at the first three paragraphs, yes? Defending first impressions is defending the pre-readers for doing that.
No. 751
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751
Constructive criticism is probably a habit - I know a lot of people like to have a very honest response to whatever they post so they can grow and improve, and I think that's become the norm rather than the exception with regard to how people treat comment boxes. I can understand not wanting it though and sharing something just for general fun and enjoyment, so I definitely see where you are coming from ^_^

From my side (if I didn't know) I'd possibly end up dropping a little bit in (along with saying what's good about it though - that's important!) to show that I care and paid attention to the content. I know quite a few find it a bit insincere if they just receive praise and nothing else ^^
But I'd certainly not do it if it was unwelcome, nor try to if it's clear it's just shared for fun between friends.

As for saying "You need to be slapped by a well written book and learn how to write!" though, that's not constructive, that's plain rude and arrogant - and I wholeheartedly agree with you that people shouldn't be saying things like that.
No. 753
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753
>>691
May I object? Not really with the entire concept, but with the part where you are comparing EQD to /fic/, these two are as similar to one another as RPG is to FPS.
EQD differs from /fic/ for the simple reason that it's, as it has been mentioned before, a display window, it's a place where the best fanworks are shared with the pickiest audience. You want to share a fanfic? Great! There are sites for that! But EQD specializes, from my point of view, in displaying fanwork where the audience has been considered during the production. If you don't care about the audience, then why should EQD care about you? A bit selfish of you, eh?
And to those that complain that they were mistreated by pre-readers, I don't know if there were any serious cases, but if you get a message that states something like "You need to improve your grammar" or "you should work on character development", then maybe you should take a moment to sit right there and take this critique to the heart? Because I'm talking here from personal experience now, but when I am clustered with a shit ton of fuck, then I'd tend to be missing a lot fuck due to the enormous amounts of fuck if I'd want to deal with it in one go, so I usually use my fork and knife to cut the fuck into little pieces instead of swallowing it whole, and I'd probably guess same story applies to them, maybe those character development or grammar problems shine so brightly that they blind the pre-readers from giving any further feedback?
What else... Ah! If you get such a short review as nope, then maybe you should really re-evaluate your story since it quite possibly is that bad or just send it to different pre-reader? And the "go away" comment? Sounds quite nasty, but then again, I'd prefer to check for the context of this reply, because it sounds more like an attempt to vilify EQD pre-readers.
>inb4 flankhurt EQD reader
Hate all you want, but I have huge respect for these guys. They spend their free time to sort through a shit-ton of fanfics on daily basis and even provide with through review of your work (sometimes) for free just for the sake of bronies, that is quite amazing if you ask me, because I am certain that I wouldn't be able to do half of what they're doing right now, especially considering that the stream of the fanfics being submitted is quite probably steadily increasing.
P.s. I was also one of those writers that got a real short review, and you know what? I'm not surprised. Not more that half a year later I've read through it and ho-ly sheit, I was willing to bulge my eyes out, I was in so much emotional pain because of reading it and because of conciousness reminding me that I've let someone else through this hell. What did I learn? Not to rush artwork.
I think that's roughly all the points I had to cover...
No. 761
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761
I know your feel having done alot of artwork and almost never received a comment, except only when i did it was someone telling why it sucks or whats wrong with it and then they draw something even worse lol happens all the time i probably do the same thing

but really mostly its just because not many people go to art threads to 'chat' so unless your making friends and inciting people to discussion all your likely to get is criticism

the goal should really to understand first and foremost that either you A create the work for yourself and the enjoyment of anyone should happen to also see it, in which case you wont care if people are criticizing your work, (this is exceedingly rare) or you are creating it to be recognized or accepted in which case you just have to accept other people like other things and are going to heavily criticize you, the key is learning to accept criticism gracefully, i try to accept criticism as a gift of knowledge whether the person is right or wrong, either way i still learned something, wisemen learn more from fools than fools form wise men, now if we could only get people to act this way (read: not going to happen)